Brandon Holley: Yahoo's Shine Is Not a Women's Magazine
The editor in chief of Yahoo's new Web site for women says that user comments are a key part of the content "experience." In fact, Shine is considering paying some of its bloggers for their contributions.

By Patrick Phillips
I Want Media, 04/07/08

Brandon Holley is the editor in chief of Shine, Yahoo's newly launched Web site for women, offering articles, features and user blogs covering subjects found in many traditional women's magazines -- fashion, beauty, relationships, health, food, parenting, careers, and more. The advertising-supported site is packed with content from deals with leading magazine publishers like Conde Nast, Hearst, Time Inc., and Rodale.

Shine also serves up original content from staff editors and writers, as well as the site's users, who are allowed to post and update their own blogs. Hundreds of users signed up to run blogs on Shine within the first few days of the site's launch, says Holley, a former editor in chief of the now-defunct Jane and Elle Girl magazines.

All of Shine's bloggers are unpaid so far, she says. But, "if they became very, very popular, we would probably make them columnists."

I Want Media: Is Shine basically a women's magazine?

Brandon Holley: It's not a magazine, really. It's a women's Web site set up in a blog format, because we've found that that's how women are interested in getting information, in a time-sensitive way.

It's women's content, so it does have some of the aspects that you might find in a women's magazine. But it's very, very different in that it's made up of short bits that are updated regularly. It can't really be a magazine, because most women's magazines are updated once a month. We're updated every 40 minutes.

IWM: Who is the Shine reader?

Holley: Her median age is 35. She has probably got kids, although not specifically. She may work; she might work at home, taking care of her children. She is interested in connecting with the world and with other women around her.

We know that she's time-starved; we know that she's not finding what she wants online in one place. So we've tried to provide a site that will give her those things. We're going to have a lot of commentary and voice, and a lot of user-generated stuff that populates the site.

IWM: How is editing Shine different from editing a print magazine?

Holley: The first thing I did when I started Elle Girl was launch the Web site, and that was back in about 2000. We had the users vote on who would appear in the magazine. So by the time the magazine hit newsstands about six months later, it was actually already populated with stuff from users of the Web site. I figured this was kind of great.

Later, when I was at Jane, I did a few things that were really fun online. I spent a lot of time launching that site. It did not have a real site when I got there.

And when Jane shut down, I kind of thought my print days might be over, so I started looking around at online stuff. And now that I'm at a very serious, huge online company, the thing I've learned is that content is content. We're still making great stuff to get the reader engaged, just like I did in a magazine. There were a few techno-words that I didn't know, but I've learned. [laughter]

IWM: Do Shine's editors work in an office?

Holley: I work from an office here in New York, but I get to work from home a couple days a week as well. The other editors work from home. They love it.

It's made it easier for me to choose exactly who I wanted, because they didn't have to be specifically New York. We've got editors in San Francisco, L.A., Rhode Island, Chicago ... all over the country. But it's amazing how we haven't lost that office dynamic. We still feel like we're working together. It doesn't feel too disparate.

IWM: Several leading magazine publishers are providing content to Shine. But do they risk weakening their own brands online by doing so? I mean, why go to Conde Nast's Allure.com when similar material is on Shine?

Holley: Shine is a great distribution opportunity for them. Yahoo has 40 million women a month coming through its doors. And once you read the content from Allure, we pass you back to Allure.com. So you come to Shine and then we pass you on to other places on the Web.

IWM: Shine launched just days ago, but what have you learned from your users so far?

Holley: I'm reading through the comments now. Let's see ... Carla Bruni Sarkozy is not generally loved by everyone. [laughter] Be very careful when you call a pregnant woman "overweight." ...

Women really love to post comments. They love to interact; they love to share information. We're getting a lot of users putting up posts.

When you edit a magazine, you sort of send it out into the ether and hope that you'll get something back, maybe in the form of a letter. But on Shine, we get response within hours through posted comments. Our editors are then able to comment on the comments, and the conversation we start is really exciting. The comments become part of the experience, part of the story.

IWM: Will Shine's content be shaped by comments or traffic to certain articles?

Holley: Oh, absolutely. If our readers are loving things, we will give them more of the same. And if it's something that is not something that people are responding to across the board, then, unless we feel like it's something that we feel committed to -- like a green issue or something in politics -- then we probably won't serve it up. This is more of a democratic process.

IWM: One woman reader posted a sarcastic comment about Shine, saying: "Really, Yahoo? Astrology, fashion and beauty? This is sooo exciting for us gals. I'll check it out tonight after I do the dishes, as long as my husband says it's OK to use the computer. ..." Is traditional women's service journalism what women want on the Web?

Holley: You know, I would love to make a Web site that pleased everybody. But I know from years of doing this that if you're everybody's best friend, you end up pleasing nobody.

IWM: Shine is allowing readers to start their own blogs on the site. Why?

Holley: The idea is that this is not ivory-tower-style editing where you just get the editors on high telling you what's in and what's out. Because some women want advice from other women. They might not want advice from an editor.

IWM: Will Shine's bloggers be paid for their contributions?

Holley: If we find that they become a regular part of Shine, we would then establish some kind of longer-term association with them. If they became very, very popular, we would probably make them columnists. Nothing will happen for the first several months, because we sort of need to see how this comes out.

IWM: Is the Internet the best way to reach the women's audience today?

Holley: I do believe it is.

IWM: But what about all those women's magazines?

Holley: I think they're great, too. There are things that women's magazines offer that are wonderful. But there's a Pew Study that just came out that says women are actually driving the traffic online. This is a medium that works for women very well.

Women use magazines different than they use online. Online is something they can check in every day; a magazine might be something they buy when they have a quiet moment.

IWM: Many magazines are folding and laying off staff, as you saw firsthand at Jane and Elle Girl. Do magazines in print face a cloudy future?

Holley: I don't think so. There may be a thinning out over the next several years, perhaps. But you can't do a 20-page fashion portfolio online. You just don't get that same heavy print feel. And I still prefer to read long-form articles in a print magazine. I mean, I'm never going to cancel my New Yorker subscription.

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